Real English Conversations: Perfectionism 2

Posted on March 15, 2010
Filed under British vs. American English, Learning tips, Listening, Real English conversations, Upper intermediate | 25 Comments

Standard Podcast [ 7:45 ] Play Now | Play in Popup | Download

Download English lesson podcast and transcript

Download this English lesson podcastDownload PDF transcriptDownload MSWord transcript

Introduction
Hi, Lori here welcoming you to another episode of Real English Conversations from BetterAtEnglish.com. In today’s conversation, my friend Yvette and I continue our discussion about perfectionism. The main focus of this part of the conversation is how perfectionist tendencies can cause problems in foreign language learning, particularly for adult learners. Another thing that comes up is a couple of usage differences between British and American English. So without further ado, here is the conversation:

Conversation Transcript

Lori: But you know, speaking about correction, it’s kind of interesting when you think about learning a language as an adult, how perfectionism and having, like, demands on yourself when it comes to performing…I think that’s one of the biggest differences between learning the language as an adult and, then, picking one up as a child.

Yvette: Yeah I remember when I was in university at the very beginning in the first year I spoke British English with a British English accent, and I was studying American English or American studies. And I had a lot of American-speaking professors who, umm, just, you know, I thought it was really odd to be using British language to talk to an American professor, so I switched to American English, which was really frowned upon because it was not the “proper” language. And everything that you did, every word you used, you had to think, “Is this the proper American word or is it a British-ism?” Because it was…you were punished much more severely for using British-isms as an American speaker than if you were a British speaker using American words. It was really weird.

Lori: Yet there’s this kind of weird…at least in some classroom contexts…there’s this weird elitism when it comes to British English and American English, and like there’s these weird synthetic rules about what you’re allowed to say and what’s acceptable and what isn’t. And, you know, native speakers out in the world, they mix and match as they see fit.

Yvette: Right. Right, because, like, I would have to look out and make sure that I didn’t use the word “pavement,” and you can say that very American-like…pavement…and then they would be like, “No, it’s ‘sidewalk.’ So, you’re wrong.” And it’s like, “Oh, you know what I mean, though!”

I know that I got punished for that, and there were other things like “ten after six” or “ten past six”…I, you know, if you say something like “ten past six” in American voice it’s really wrong because you have to say “ten after six,” which is something I didn’t even know until I was corrected. And it was like, “Oops, I didn’t know there was a difference.”

Lori: Wow, well, speaking as American I would say say that’s something I didn’t even know.

[Laughter]

Yvette: There you go! So, but then you get to the perfection level, then you want to be absolutely correct.

Lori: But yeah, sometimes I wish I could get back to the state that I remember having as a kid. You know — when I’m trying to create something and start battling with perfectionist tendencies and procrastination and all the demands I place on myself, and the ones that I imagine that other people are placing on me — I wish I could just throw it all out the window and just approach it with the carefree abandon that I remember having as a little kid.

Yvette: The thing of course is when you…now you work, and it actually…you make money doing things and people expect a certain standard of you, and you try to hold to that standard but often that standard is in your own head and it’s not even what they’re expecting you to do. So you end up doing a lot more work for something that is really not worth the money that you get paid for it.
Lori: Yeah. There is that as well.

Yvette: On top of that! But you know, as a kid I think I was already quite perfectionist in everything, I… everything had to be perfect, everything had to be done properly.

Lori: Yeah.

Yvette: And I felt like I was going to get punished if I didn’t, so that — not to say anything bad about my parents, but, because I don’t think they ever held me to that standard; they always said, “Do your best and that’s good enough.” But for me it had to be perfect, and then it’s maybe “okay.”

Lori: Yeah. Yeah, but, but even so I can still remember, like, approaching new things and just being willing to just try new things that I knew I was going to suck at, because there’s no way you can be good at something right at the very beginning. And it just didn’t matter; you were willing to just give it a go anyway. And now I really sympathize with the people, my, my students that I used to have when I taught English, my adult students, how horrible it can be to sit in a group…and you know you need to try to speak the language but you know you’re going to make mistakes and you know it’s not going to be right but you have to force yourself to try anyway. And it’s…I think, yeah, for people like me anyway, it’s really hard to force yourself to do that.

Yvette: Well yeah it is, it is about letting go of the judgment that other people are going to have. You know, when I, went I went to the United States for the first time and I felt really kind of embarrassed about speaking English, people were very surprised that you were able to even speak the language and understand what they were saying because they had no idea of what you were saying if you spoke Dutch. I mean, they were like, you know, I could switch to Dutch and they were like, “I don’t know, that sounds really strange and odd.” And so that kind of helped me along at the time because I knew that my, you know, what I could do or how I could speak was better than what they could speak my language, and they very often would say, “Well, you speak better English than I do.” And I thought, “Oh, I don’t think so.”

Lori: Yeah, well you know most…your English is fantastic, as you know, as I’ve often told you.

Yvette: Well, thank you.

Lori: But…

Yvette: That’s right!

Lori: But, even so, most Americans, they’re just amazed that anyone can speak a language other than their own, because even though I think most of us do study a foreign language in high school, oftentimes it never gets past the classroom level, you know, the school level, where really, you can do okay on written tests but you can’t really have a conversation.

Yvette: Yeah, and that’s the thing, and it’s also, you know, other little phrases that people use all the time when they speak, which is probably what this is all about. it’s just speaking and listening to people just talking…normal phrases instead of these textbook phrases that nobody understands anyway. I mean, or nobody uses.

Lori: Yeah, they’re so far removed from what you hear out in the real world that it’s…

Yvette: Right. “I would like a hotel room…”

Lori: Please, for one. Please.

Yvette: With a bath. With a bath and a shower.

[Laughter]

Final Words


That’s all for this time. In our next conversation, we’ll be talking about some of the British and American English usage questions that came up in this conversation, particularly with respect to the prepositions “past” and “after” when talking about time. As always, the full transcript and vocabulary notes for this podcast are available on our website, BetterAtEnglish.com. Thanks for listening, and bye for now!

Vocabulary list
Download full vocabulary notes here

Picking one up
frowned upon
synthetic
mix and match
look out
There you go!
throw it all out the window
carefree abandon
end up
there is that
on top of that
suck
give it a go
letting go
far removed

25 Comments

Comments

25 Responses to “Real English Conversations: Perfectionism 2”

  1. JEANJEAN says:
    March 16, 2010 at 10:21

    Thank your so much !!! Lori :razz:

    …ps : and you’re so beautiful !

  2. Antonia says:
    March 16, 2010 at 18:09

    :grin: Hello! I really like all this stuff, Lori, these podcasts are really English. I’ve been recommending them to my students and they’re enjoying! Thanks for all your job! ;-)

  3. Taz says:
    March 16, 2010 at 18:27

    I still love this podcast! :grin:
    Greetz Taz :cool:

    • Lori says:
      March 20, 2010 at 22:31

      TAZZZZIE! I need to get you on here as a special guest :-)

      • Taz says:
        April 4, 2010 at 13:49

        Whoops missed this post! As said before: Once I stop mumbling and you are really really really desperate we can discuss this again (I am sure you want to keep your readers instead of chasing them away ;-) )

        Greetz Taz

  4. tod says:
    March 17, 2010 at 14:24

    Good job! I still not sure about that pavement, can you please explain that? Thanks

    • Lori says:
      March 17, 2010 at 22:06

      Tod, in British English, the word “pavement” describes the paved side of the road that you are supposed to WALK on. In American English, the “pavement” is the paved surface of the road that you DRIVE on. Americans use the word “sidewalk” to describe the part of the road that you are supposed to walk on. You can see how the word “pavement” could cause confusion, for example, if an American heard a British English speaker telling children, “Watch out for the cars – stay on the pavement!” or something like that.

      I hope this clears it up for you.

  5. jay says:
    March 17, 2010 at 21:27

    i really admire what you are doing for us
    thank you very much

  6. tarik says:
    March 18, 2010 at 11:32

    it is good to hear your voice again

    • Lori says:
      March 20, 2010 at 22:32

      Thanks, Tarik. I remember you from the forum. Sorry to say the spammers have ruined the forum, and it probably won’t be back. But I will try to be more active here in the comments section. Nice to know you’re still listening! :-)

  7. Marco Brainiac says:
    March 19, 2010 at 14:52

    Hi Lori,

    Very good job! it’s so detailed with explanation vocabulary, great visual and we can see real English!

    sorry for my English, I need training more and more…

    Congratulations form Brazil…

    Marco Brainiac

    • Lori says:
      March 20, 2010 at 22:33

      Thanks, Marco. The vocabulary and transcripts are the most time-consuming part of the podcasts, so I’m glad to hear when people actually use them. Good luck with your continued learning! :-)

  8. Luis Miguel says:
    March 20, 2010 at 21:59

    Hi Lorie… I love your podcast… they are useful and funny..Besides you have a nice voice and I can understand the intros and when you talk to Yvette or Michael

    Thank you so much :razz:

    Greetings from Colombia

    • Lori says:
      March 20, 2010 at 22:29

      Thanks Luis — I’m glad you’re finding the podcasts useful. As for my speaking voice, I speak rather slowly these days because I’ve lived outside the USA for about 20 years, and nearly all my English speaking since then has been with non-native speakers. That tends to slow you down a bit!

  9. Mauri says:
    March 22, 2010 at 06:45

    This was a very interesting topic! I really loved it!
    Lori… Just one question… Do you really exist? I mean, aren’t you a super computer or something like that? :grin: Just to know you a little bit more: what’s the simplest thing that makes you feel the happiest person in the world? I would say that I like to squash mosquitos… I hate them… Horrible tiny and cruel blood-suckers… :|

    Thanks for helping us!

    Mauri :)

    Greetings from Argentina

  10. Nifin says:
    April 1, 2010 at 06:18

    Excellent work,thank you very much,thanks to china232.com, they only introduced you to us.

  11. marisel2008 says:
    April 3, 2010 at 02:06

    Hi Lori!

    Thank you very much for your job!
    It’s really very useful for us.
    Have a nice time

    Marisel

  12. isma says:
    April 4, 2010 at 06:42

    Lori,Are you the girl in the photograph? because you are really beutiful.
    I just want to tell you that I really enjoy your work, i`m a learner now but i`m learning so fast with your podcast.
    Thanks a lot.

  13. wenjing says:
    April 24, 2010 at 13:47

    Hi Lori
    what a fantastic website.

    I really enjoy the podcast and appreciate your work!

    Greetings from China

  14. Ruta says:
    April 28, 2010 at 09:20

    Good job! It is the first time I’ve found something really interesting and useful at the same time. I think it is a very good idea if you can hear native English speech and read the conversation-it is much easier to understand. Thanks! Greetings from Lithuania (we know about you even here :) )

  15. Mohsen says:
    June 6, 2010 at 19:39

    Hi dear and Gorgeous Lori,
    i wish you best from far far away.
    xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
    yours

  16. Gracie says:
    November 15, 2010 at 18:25

    I’ve just found out this website and I’m really loving it. Thanks Lori and all the better@english staff, it’s really helpfull.
    Have a great week ;-)
    Love from Brazil

    Gracie